The MGB could have been the British 911

"BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires" (biturbo228)
10/12/2013 at 09:10 • Filed to: None

I can't help but think that if MG had doggedly stuck it out with the 'B like Porsche had with the 911 they'd have created something not only fantastic but lasting as well. Hear me out...

The MGB was one of the best selling and most loved British sports cars of all time. What put paid to it was brilliant cars like the Mk1 Golf GTi and 240Z that came along and instantly made it look antiquated, anaemic and slow. Instead of rising to the challenge, MG didn't (or couldn't) develop it to meet the competition on equal terms. As such, when the time came to replace the 'B, sales were not strong enough to justify more than a half-hearted attempt.

This need not have been the case.

Here's how I would have played it differently.

The MGB was very popular in America prior to the challenge of the 240Z, and MG should have done something to respond to it. Scrap the MGC, and go straight for developing the MGB V8. I reckon Americans back in the day would have lapped up the mashup of British sports car and American V8 for a sub-pony car price.

Give it the 146bhp version of the RV8 found in the P6, rather than the less inspiring 137bhp it came with in reality. Price it close to the 240Z and let the comparisons roll in.

Over the coming years further little developments could be made to the V8 engine raising the power. 180bhp is an easily achievable goal simply with more performance oriented carbs, and hotter cams can push that further. They could even have bolted up the fuel injected 190bhp V8 from the SD1 for a flying version.

They could continue to sell the 4-cylinder version for a lower price, especially in Europe. This would also give them some protection from the '73 oil crisis as they've got something relatively economical to sell as well.

Due to the inherent strength of the MGB shell, later versions could have had stonking great V8s from the TVR portfolio with negligible modifications to the structure, replete with big flared wheelarches and meaty tyres. They could even go parts-bin raiding and fit them with Jaguar IRS systems (a common modification nowadays).

The 4-cylinder versions could keep the live axle setup to keep costs down, but later BL engines like the BMC S-series could be fitted to keep power at a reasonable level. Injected versions could be sold to keep comparisons to the Golf GTi positive as well.

By then, they might have the funds for a clean-sheet new MGB and MGB V8, using the stupidly light, powerful and revvy K-series engines and a clean-sheet relatively small displacement all-alloy V8. Or they could just repeat the trick they did in the '60s and buy the tooling to last year's Chevy LS.

I reckon they could have kept production of the original MGB profitable right the way up until the late 80s/early 90s, replaced it with something immense, and built one hell of a cult surrounding them.

Shame they didn't really.

DISCUSSION (13)

Pockets > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/12/2013 at 10:34

Uh, they did kind of all that you're saying, only slower and missing the boat on a couple of occasions. Because, y'know, hindsight and all that.

They did a V8 version in the 70s, brought it back with the RV8 as a short-term-fix in the early '90s (to build hype for the long-in-development MGF), and then went and did a k-series based take on it with the MG F.

I think if you look at any single period of BL/AR/RG/MGR's history it's easy to pick up on "oh, should have done this", but most of the stupid mistakes are down to a lack of cash to do anything else resulting in lots of missed opportunities - Clean sheet V8? The continued development of the RV8 was one of the best and most cost-efficient moves the company made. Replacing it would have been throwing money away on a niche item.

Milky > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/12/2013 at 11:50

I like the idea of this ..... It's a damn sexy car to boot.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > Pockets
10/12/2013 at 13:38

Agreed. I know about the 70s V8 version, that's what I reckon is the biggest missed opportunity of the lot when it comes to the MGB. The Z came along and made the 'B look slow. A ~150bhp MGB could have kept it current, kept it profitable and led to a potentially different history for MG. One where they might be making something more impressive than 2 lukewarm hatchbacks and an also-ran saloon.

The clean-sheet V8 eventuality is based on an entirely different history for MG, one where they were much more profitable and had enough capital to do something significant.

The trouble with the RV8 was that it was out of date when it was released.

Also, there had been a long break between the last B and this. Thus, it seemed like a rehash of the old car. There hadn't been the fluid evolution from past to present day of the 911.

I'd imagine a similar response if they'd killed the 911 in the 70s, and then brought out the 993 in the 90s. It might be a kickass car, but it'd seem like a pastiche of the old car.

Aaron Short - PROUD OF LEYLAND > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/12/2013 at 14:27

Kinja'd!!!

They did do that, the RV8??

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > Aaron Short - PROUD OF LEYLAND
10/12/2013 at 15:46

Too little too late. That's the level of tech that should have been in the 'B by 1980. It was a little outdated when it came out in '93.

Also, they left it too long and it seemed too much like a rehash of an old idea. If they'd have had continuous development between then and now, that may not have been the case.

I reckon it would have been similar to if Porsche had killed the classic 911 in the '70s and gone on to make other things. Then, in the '90s they came out with the 993. It may be an excellent car, but it would still have seemed like a pastiche of the old 911 with derivative styling.

Aaron Short - PROUD OF LEYLAND > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/12/2013 at 15:56

BL were too busy striking, designing 3 different cars to compete against one another and making their cars fit stupid american laws in the 80's to develop the mgb.

Also, as much as it pains me to say it, as a proud brit, but we really REALLY suck at changing the designs of our popular cars, if they sell well, we flog them to DEATH.

Mini, Defender, Minor(they still made it in the 70's!), metro, morgans, caterham 7's....

the morgans and caterhams where developed underneath and are much better than their ancestors, but some people just cant look past the ye olde styling!

On the other hand, we developed and improved he range rover and the old(new?) bird is still going strong!

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > Aaron Short - PROUD OF LEYLAND
10/12/2013 at 16:37

"Also, as much as it pains me to say it, as a proud brit, but we really REALLY suck at changing the designs of our popular cars, if they sell well, we flog them to DEATH"

Hah. Hit the nail on the head with that one.

Just think about the XJ. The base design of that never strayed far from 1968 to 2008. The tech was upgraded, but the design never changed (similar to the 911 now that you think of it, except the 911's styling still looks current).

herald > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/18/2013 at 15:45

These are still beautiful cars! I also think you could achieve a similar - or even better effect with an SBC implant.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > herald
10/18/2013 at 19:15

You could certainly achieve better power with an SBC, but there are a couple of reasons I'd still go with the Rover V8.

The first one is that the factory made a version with the Rover V8, so there's provenance there.

The second is that, while the SBC is relatively light, it's still a lump compared to the Rover/Buick V8. A Chevy 350 weighs somewhere in the region of 260kg (573lbs), and an LS1 weighs 208kg (459lbs). Much more power, but enough to knock the balance right off in such a small car (the Rover/Buick V8 weighed less than the cast-iron I4 that MGBs originally came with, around 150kg dressed).

If you're going full-on resto-mod, then an SBC is the way forwards. If you're going for something the factory could have produced, had they had a secret skunkworks at the time, an RV8 is what I'd choose.

herald > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/19/2013 at 02:37

A very good point - thank you!

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > herald
10/19/2013 at 05:34

No probs :)

I suppose it's a little different over here in the UK. Rover V8s are a dime a dozen, whereas SBCs are fairly rare. In the US it's the other way around.

herald > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
10/19/2013 at 12:44

Of course this would be fun!

Kinja'd!!!

Turner950s > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires
11/03/2013 at 18:38

I've seen the black and gold one with shell and hoosier logos on it in person at the Pittsburgh Vintage GP. Remarkably clean for a race car. Rumor has it that it's channeled.

http://www.zapparacing.com/